[影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

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猫咪头
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[影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by 猫咪头 » 2010-03-08 19:03

看过电影的和看过书的来碰个头。
Leo = Leo's charactor = 剧中主角 Teddy/Andrew
Clues:
1. When Leo's charactor first got off the boat, all the guards are "a little bit on the toes". It was said they were worried about the run away female patient. But they actually are all watching Leo, the male patient who were let loose;

2. Chuck, the other marshall, had problem releasing his own firearms;

3. The nurses, male or female, appeared quite absent minded during the investigation. Looking back, why, of course, they know it's just a show. Same with the cops just playing around when they are supposely searching for the missing woman;

4. When the marshalls were interviewing the patients, Leo's charactor knew exactly how to annoy one of the male patient (by rubbing pencil on paper) How did he knew? He had lived there for 2 years;

5. Also during the interview of the patients, one female patient was using flirting terms "easy on the eye" on the missing Dr. Sheehan, and she was looking at Chuck. Why they are the same person.

6. Also during the interview of the patients, Chuck (Dr. Sheehan) was sitting sideway, watching both the incoming patients, and Leo's charactor.

7. "why are you all wet, baby" is the key sentence. It appeared 3 times:
First time, in the beginging, leo dreamed of his dead wife, "remember the smoke got to her". But before she crumble into ashes, she was soaking wet and began bleeding in Leo's hands.

Second time, at the lighthouse, the bald doctor greeted Leo with this sentence. Leo's chcactor was wetting from swimming, but that is not the point.

Finally, we learned the origin of this sentence. This is a question Leo asked his wife at the original crime scene. After he went home that day, he first poured himself some drink. Then he went on to meet his family as usual, asked about his children. He finally realized something must be wrong with his wife. This sentence marked the turning point of Leo's life.

-------------------------------------
以下是看过电影后我自己琢磨的事儿。

The reason Leo's charactor was said to be the most dangerous patient on the island is, drum roll... he was charged with 4X murders.

You see, it is hard to tell whether a dead person has mental problems. When the cops finally got to the crime scene, what could they see: 3 drown children, one wet and shot wife, and the only living person is the wet and insane husband. There must be evidence of him being in the lake, and him firing the shot. Leo probably already gone insane, and claiming he had no children, and his wife died in a fire. It's logical that the cops/court decided Leo murdered all his children and wife.

The children's time of death must be close to the time Leo got home. Hence Leo's guilt trips in his dreams, his daughter saying "you could have saved us".

The doctors on the island must have found out about the meaning of the sentence "why are you all wet, baby". It means Leo's wife drown the baby, and he is not a 4x murderer. That's maybe why Dr. Sheehan and the bald doctor took great sympathy to Leo, went to great length to bring him to reality.

Am I over analyzing?
MMT

tiffany
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by tiffany » 2010-03-09 9:22

前阿土仔时代我看过这书!所以情节不太记得了,就是觉得这个家伙实在是写恐怖故事的高手,比石提粉肯强多了。当时还以为他是专写恐怖书的。

这家伙写的那本儿gone baby gone是唯一一本因为写的太好而我看了一半儿就没看下去的书。
乡音无改鬓毛衰

幻儿
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by 幻儿 » 2010-03-09 11:38

呃,我发现这个电影很奇怪。我刚看完的的时候非常有讨论的冲动,可是现在俺没有任何想法了 :headscratch:

mirrorflower
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by mirrorflower » 2010-03-09 13:50

tiffany wrote:前阿土仔时代我看过这书!所以情节不太记得了,就是觉得这个家伙实在是写恐怖故事的高手,比石提粉肯强多了。当时还以为他是专写恐怖书的。

这家伙写的那本儿gone baby gone是唯一一本因为写的太好而我看了一半儿就没看下去的书
为啥啊?题材问题?太intensive?

这个电影我一直犹豫着——我就是那种爱看恐怖故事胆子又不够大的人。唯一的看了不怕的恐怖故事是第六感,因为太美好太温情了。
"A wealth of information creates a poverty of attention."

tiffany
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by tiffany » 2010-03-09 14:35

太痛苦了,那个题目。
乡音无改鬓毛衰

mirrorflower
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by mirrorflower » 2010-03-14 0:15

哎我看了这个帖子强忍住没看内容,看了一大半的小说和一小半的电影,把整个故事看完了。然后回头把这个帖子看了。

——关于猫咪头的猜想,我没看出来哪儿提到了Andrew被charged 4x murder? 也许我听漏了?我的印象是说他危险是说他攻击过很多病人和工作人员之类的?比如那个可怜的Noyce几乎被他打死,因为叫他真名了。
"A wealth of information creates a poverty of attention."

mirrorflower
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Joined: 2008-11-04 17:26

Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by mirrorflower » 2010-03-14 2:38

嗯,我又回头把小说看完了。

感慨说,书写的更仔细。看起来甚至Andrew都不是非打算杀了他妻子——他妻子自己也想得到解脱。那个地方看着非常非常悲伤。

电影我觉得不看书的话,因为细节交代得略少,不如书更有感染力。但是电影在结尾加了一句话我还挺喜欢的,就是Andrew说," I aways wonder, which is better: to live as a monster, or die as a good man?" 然后他走向了那群要给他做手术的人。仿佛你都想说,这结果也是他自己想选择的了。
"A wealth of information creates a poverty of attention."

猫咪头
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by 猫咪头 » 2010-03-17 5:06

mirrorflower wrote:关于猫咪头的猜想,我没看出来哪儿提到了Andrew被charged 4x murder
书里也没有么。本来是我脑补, 看来我想得比作者还多。


至于电影在结尾加的那一句话,我倒不喜欢。一个故事有一个底韵。这个故事是讲生命中不能承受的那些意外。故事的高潮是有序(Terry/US marshall/阴谋论)到无序(patient 67)的大变身。生命往往是不能选择,无法掌控。那句话太美国超人式,太破坏我情绪了。
MMT

tiffany
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by tiffany » 2010-03-17 7:35

我觉得这本书最吓人的地方是他第二天早晨醒过来,又是一个新早晨,一切重头来过......
乡音无改鬓毛衰

mirrorflower
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Joined: 2008-11-04 17:26

Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by mirrorflower » 2010-03-17 8:02

猫咪头 wrote:
mirrorflower wrote:关于猫咪头的猜想,我没看出来哪儿提到了Andrew被charged 4x murder
书里也没有么。本来是我脑补, 看来我想得比作者还多。


至于电影在结尾加的那一句话,我倒不喜欢。一个故事有一个底韵。这个故事是讲生命中不能承受的那些意外。故事的高潮是有序(Terry/US marshall/阴谋论)到无序(patient 67)的大变身。生命往往是不能选择,无法掌控。那句话太美国超人式,太破坏我情绪了。
:mrgreen: 我看出来了,我就喜欢问题可以被简化被解释被控制的调调。否则我脑子就要烙烧饼,累得慌。
"A wealth of information creates a poverty of attention."

mirrorflower
Posts: 1263
Joined: 2008-11-04 17:26

Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by mirrorflower » 2010-03-17 8:04

tiffany wrote:我觉得这本书最吓人的地方是他第二天早晨醒过来,又是一个新早晨,一切重头来过......
这个就是高潮之后的反高潮——或者又一高潮?就跟我以前看过的日本恐怖片“催眠”一样。当时大家都以为事情已经了结了,在一个风景优美的医院,男主角起来喝水——忽然你就意识到,其实恐怖还没有走,只见他越喝越急,还不能停。。。

这个我倒是有准备,因为前头那个医生不是说了?“We've been here before, Andrew".然后说他第二天早上就自动倒带了。
"A wealth of information creates a poverty of attention."

roulette
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Re: [影片] Shutter Island 看过的进来讨论

Post by roulette » 2010-04-10 22:56

医生非常Carl Rogers,相信人,尊重人。结果实验失败,证明人性软弱不如靠手术刀。结果影片暗示男主是自己选择了"to die as a good man",无法改变躯体的软弱,可还是有权决定自己的意志。一波三折啊。
猫咪头 wrote:那句话太美国超人式,太破坏我情绪了。
我倒是因为这句话对这电影彻底改容相敬。健康的人能为自己做决定,而不是使自己的决定都能带来符合理性的结果。这才是吃透了人本therapy方法的精髓?前途是绝对悲观的,可大家还是要把自己当回事,相信这就是胜利。

而且,没这句话,医生的治疗思路就得不到最后肯定了,人的复杂性也说不出来。不“美国超人”,也不德国超人,中国圣人两千五百年前就说过:“三军可夺帅也,匹夫不可夺志也。” 即使是无法控制自己行为(谋杀犯,不管是几重吧),也无法控制自己思维(C栋疯子)的人,也还是有那什么自由意志在的。想想生命中的其他种种问题,多励志啊:wink:

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